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So we have this message that marriage is supposed to be the most important relationship in your life, supposed to be your best friend, and so on.
我們傳達的信息是，婚姻應該是你生命中最重要的關系，應該是你最好的朋友，等等。
But there's a disconnect with the reality, which is that marriage rates have plummeted, and for those who do get married, they're likely to get married much later than they were several decades ago.
但現實情況卻與此脫節，即結婚率大幅下降，而對于那些已婚人士來說，他們結婚的時間可能比幾十年前要晚得多。
And this has opened up, I think, a lot of space and an appetite for people to figure out: "What do alternatives look like? Is there really only one path to having a fulfilled life?"
我認為這為人們提供了很大的空間和興趣去弄清楚：“替代方案是什么樣的？通往充實生活的道路真的只有一條嗎？”
And that's where, I think, you're seeing some of this innovation and thinking more expansively about friendship coming from.
我認為，這就是你看到一些創新并更廣泛地思考友誼的原因。
There's an appetite for more creativity, to know that there's more than one option, whether because you never get married,
人們渴望更多的創造力，知道有不止一種選擇，無論是因為你從未結婚，
or you have a romantic relationship and you survive your spouse, or the relationship ends, and knowing that there are other ways to find these really core needs.
還是你有一段戀愛關系并且你比配偶活得長，或者這段關系結束了，并且知道還有其他方法可以找到這些真正核心的需求。
And based on the research you did for your book, how do you think that this de-emphasis on friendship hurts us as individuals and, you know, maybe even hurts our marriages and other romantic partnerships as well?
根據您為這本書所做的研究，您認為這種對友誼的淡化會對我們個人造成怎樣的傷害，甚至對我們的婚姻和其他戀愛關系帶來什么影響？
By expecting so much of marriage and so little of friendship, we end up undermining our romantic relationships, kind of setting them up to fail,
由于對婚姻期望過高而對友誼期望過低，我們最終會破壞戀愛關系，導致戀愛關系失敗，
and we diminish and weaken our friendships by expecting so little of them and not really investing in them.
而我們對友誼的期望過低，并沒有真正投入其中，從而削弱了我們的友誼。
And on the romantic relationship front, there's research looking at how people who, in a sense, diversify their emotional portfolio—as in have more than one close person that they can turn to if something, you know, serious or significant happens—
在戀愛關系方面，有研究調查了那些在某種意義上分散情感的人（即在發生嚴重或重大事件時可以求助于多個親密的人），
that they are happier, have more stable marriages, more satisfying marriages than people who really always go, first and foremost, to their spouse.
他們比那些總是首先求助于配偶的人更幸福，婚姻更穩定，更令人滿意。
I like to think of it as the model of a kind of big-box store, is what people have in mind: you get everything in one place, and it's really efficient.
我喜歡把它看作是一種大型商店的模型，這是人們心中的想法：你可以在一個地方買到所有東西，而且非常高效。
But we also know that there are consequences when big-box stores enter, you know, enter communities and that sometimes doing something that's,
但我們也知道，當大型商店進入社區時，會產生一些后果，有時做一些事情，
like, not all in one place or getting everything in one aisle can have some other benefits, and I think that that's certainly the case for having not just your spouse,
比如，不把所有東西都放在一個地方，或者把所有東西都放在一個過道，可能會帶來其他好處，我認為這當然適用于不僅擁有你的配偶，
who is your best friend and your confidant and your career coach and your roommate and your, you know, co-parent, and so on, but having other people that you really care about.
也就是你最好的朋友、你的知己、你的職業教練、你的室友、你的共同撫養人等等，還擁有你真正關心的其他人。
And just for the flip side of friendship, if you don't think it's an important relationship or it's going to be there in the long haul,
就友誼的另一面而言，如果你認為它不是一種重要的關系，或者它不會長期存在，
then you're probably, you know, going to make that a self-fulfilling prophecy and not think about the ways that a friendship can be more enduring or be more central to your life.
那么你可能會把它變成一個自我實現的預言，而不會去思考友誼如何能更持久或在你的生活中占據更重要的地位。
What other research did you find that looked into the importance of these non-romantic friendships and partnerships?
你還發現了哪些研究這些非戀愛友誼和伙伴關系的重要性？
The research on friendship is not, like, the best research. You know, there's not, I think, particularly on adult friendship, the most robust work on this.
這項關于友誼的研究并不是最好的研究。我認為，特別是關于成人友誼的研究，在這方面還沒有最深入的研究。
And I've talked to researchers and they have very much admitted this, and I think part of it is: it is harder to study when it's not a kind of clear dyadic relationship in the way that you would with a spouse.
我和研究人員談過，他們非常承認這一點，我認為部分原因是：當友誼不像你和配偶那樣是一種明確的二元關系時，研究起來會更困難。
So the research that I look at ends up being more around surveys—so asking people about the number of close friends in their lives or, you know,
我的研究最終更多地是圍繞調查展開的——詢問人們他們生活中有多少親密的朋友，
"If something difficult happens, who is the first person that you're going to reach out to?"
或者“如果遇到困難，你會第一個聯系誰？”
And we've seen that, over just a number of decades, that Americans report having fewer close friends than they had previously.
我們發現，在過去的幾十年里，美國人報告的親密朋友比以前少了。
One researcher has called this a "friendship recession" and has done follow-up research that's really shown that there's a class difference:
一位研究人員將此稱為“友誼衰退”，并進行了后續研究，結果確實表明存在階級差異：
that people who are less educated are even less likely to have a robust circle of friends and less likely to have the kind of spaces—community spaces where they can go to and cultivate these friendships.
受教育程度較低的人更不可能擁有一個強大的朋友圈，也更不可能擁有可以去培養這些友誼的社區空間。
It just would have been the case that a few decades ago people would've had multiple close people to turn to and that that's become a lot less common and it's become far more common for people to have no friends at all.
幾十年前，人們會向多個親密的人求助，但這種情況已經變得不那么常見了，人們根本沒有朋友的情況也變得越來越普遍。
To the question of, "Who do people turn to first with a personal problem?" In 1990 [more than] a quarter of people said a friend, and now that's only 16 percent and more than half say their spouse.
對于“人們遇到個人問題時首先向誰求助？”這個問題，1990 年，[超過]四分之一的人說是朋友，而現在只有16%，超過一半的人說是配偶。
So there really is this kind of shift that's happened where people have diverted activities or kind of devotion that they would have given to friends to spouses instead. Right.
確實發生了這種轉變，人們將他們本應該給予朋友的活動或奉獻轉移到配偶身上。是的。
There's a gender divide on this, too, which might not be so surprising—I think there's growing recognition that
在這方面也存在性別差異，這可能并不奇怪——我認為人們越來越認識到，
American men are having a harder time cultivating deep friendships than women are, and you can see this in, also, how men and women behave in their friendships.
美國男性比女性更難培養深厚的友誼，你也可以從男女在友誼中的表現中看到這一點。
So, you know, within the last week about half of women have told their friends that they love them, and that's a quarter of men—so, you know, much lower rate.
在過去一周內，大約有一半的女性告訴她們的朋友，她們愛她們，而男性只有四分之一——比例要低得多。
There have been researchers who've asked questions like, "Have you had a private conversation with a friend in the last week where you've shared personal feelings?"
有研究人員問過這樣的問題：“在過去一周內，你和朋友私下交談過，分享過個人感受嗎？”
And the answer is about half for women and about a third for men, so the kind of emotional intimacy that women are more likely to have in their friendships, we're seeing less so in men's friendships.
答案是，女性約占一半，男性約占三分之一，所以女性在友誼中更有可能擁有的那種情感親密，在男性的友誼中卻很少見。
