Embo has been a controversial leader charged with mismanaging UNESCO while taking the agency in an anti-Western direction.
聯合國教科文組織領導人Embo,一直飽受爭議,有人指責他管理不善,未能做到與西方步調保持一致。
The Reagan Administration cited those reasons when pulling the US out of UNESCO in 1984.
1984年,里根政府下的美國從該組織中撤出,援引了那些內容。
Last year, the same charges were behind Britain and Singapore's decision to withdraw.
去年,英國和新加坡也出于相同原因,決定撤出該組織。
Those three defections forced UNESCO to cut its budget by thirty percent and intensified the crisis around Embo's leadership.
這三個國家的撤出迫使該組織的預算縮減了30%,加劇了Embo的領導危機。
Jean Gerard, now US Ambassador to Luxembourg, is the former US delegate to UNESCO.
現任美國駐盧森堡大使Jean Gerard,曾是聯合國教科文組織前美國代表。
Gerard recommended the US withdraw, because she felt UNESCO's programs were moving away from international cooperation toward confrontation.
Gerard曾建議美國撤出該組織,因為她覺得該組織各項目正從國際合作轉向國際對抗。
"Take, for example, the New World Information Order, where in their documents they say that the press should be an instrument of the state.
“例如,在該組織發布的文件《新世界信息秩序》中,他們說新聞媒體應成為國家的工具。
Now this, of course, is totally contrary to our concept of a free press.
當然,這完全違背了我們新聞自由的理念。
There are more and more programs, which emphasize statist type of solutions to problems.
強調利用統計方法解決問題的項目越來越多。
In education, for example, in the teacher-training program in Afghanistan, it's run solely by Soviet teachers with a Soviet coordinator.
例如,在教育方面,阿富汗教師培訓項目,完全由蘇聯教師和蘇聯協調員管理參與。
So, in essence, we were paying for the indoctrination of the Afghan people,
所以,從本質上說,我們是在為阿富汗人民的教育買單,
which again is not my idea of what an international organization ought to be doing."
這也不符合我對一個國際組織應作應為的想法。
"To what extent do you think Embo is responsible for the directions that you disproved of in UNESCO?"
“你認為Embo在其中,對你的這些指責負有多大責任?”
"I think some of them, of course, were already there, but I think they have been very much accentuated under his tenure.
“我想,當然,這些問題中有一部分是此前既已存在的,但我認為在他的任期內,這種情況更加惡化了。
And instead of taking the opportunity to reform the organization, to make it work more efficiently and in a more unbiased way, when we gave our notice of withdrawal,
當我們通知該組織撤出時,他并沒有利用機會進行組織改革,以使組織更有效公正地運轉,
there was a great clamor that there was no crisis and initially very little need for reform aside from some cosmetic reform, and a general resentment of the idea."
有人大聲疾呼說,除了一些錦上添花的改革之外,這里沒有任何危機,基本從一開始就不需要改革,這一想法引起了普遍不滿。
"Can you describe Embo as a leader, what his personality was like, what his characteristics were as a leader?"
“你能否描述一下Embo作為一名領導人的性格,他作為一名領導人有何特點?”
"I would say he's certainly very dynamic.
“他當然很有活力。
He has a great deal of charm, he has a very personal type of management style, and, I think, he tended to take criticism personally.
他魅力非凡,對于管理他自成風格,他總把批評當成是個人恩怨。
When we had discussions with him about the budget, the Assistant Secretary of State and myself in 1983,
1983年,助理國務卿和我與他討論預算問題,
since we pointed out that his figures were very different from the figures that we had under discussion,
因為我們指出他的數字與我們之前討論過的數字存在很大差異,
he then said that the United States, in essence, was behaving in a racist manner, that we had deep psychological problems."
他隨后說,本質上美國是按照種族主義行事,我們的心理問題很深。
"Do you think his resignation is a sign that UNESCO wants the United States and England back?"
“你認為他的辭職是否意味著聯合國教科文組織對美國和英國的召喚?”
"It's not, as I understand it, a resignation.
“據我所知,這不是辭職。
It was a statement saying that he would not seek a third term.
這是一份聲明,說他不會謀求第三任期連任。
That does not preclude, of course, some countries from urging him to be the candidate,
當然,這并不妨礙一些國家敦促他成為候選人,
and the Executive Board nominates the candidate to the general conference."
執行委員會也像聯合國大會對他進行了候選人提名。
"Do you know if there was any direct pressure on Embo to not seek a third term?"
“你知道Embo有沒有受到直接的壓力,迫使他無法尋求連任?”
"I know quite a few countries in their governments have been saying that they do not favor his having a third term.
“我知道有不少國家的政府一直在說,他們不贊成Embo連任第三任期。
That includes the Nordics, who went and informed him of that a few months ago. That includes Japan.
這其中也包括北歐人,幾個月前他們就把這件事告訴了他。還有日本也包括在內。
And so if you call that pressure, there certainly were several countries that indicated that were not in favor of his having a third term."
因此,如果你把這稱之為壓力的話,肯定有幾個國家對他的連任表示了反對。
"Does Embo's decision to not seek a third term represent a success for the US's decision to pull out of UNESCO?"
“Embo不尋求第三任期連任的決定是否代表美國撤出聯合國教科文組織的決定取得了成功?”
"I wouldn't say it in those words frankly. I think it's a pity he didn't take the opportunity to be the champion of reform.
“坦白來說,我不會這么講。他沒有抓住機會實施改革,我覺得很遺憾。
On the other hand, that's his decision."
另一方面,這是他的決定。”
"What would it take for you to recommend to the United States that this country rejoin UNESCO?"
“在何種情況下,你會建議美國重返聯合國教科文組織?”
"I think to have a good Director General, to see a serious constructive reform take place both in the management and in the programs.
“我認為除非遇到一個好的總干事,他在管理和項目兩方面都進行重大的建設性改革。
I think that's the kind of thing that would influence many people to take another look at it."
我想這會讓很多人重新審視這一問題。”
From Luxembourg, Ambassador Jean Gerard, former US delegate to UNESCO.
來自美國駐盧森堡大使,聯合國教科文組織前美國代表Jean Gerard。