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And while a few Indonesians have recently joined ISIS,
雖然最近還是有些印尼人加入伊斯蘭國
their number is tiny, far fewer in per capita terms than the number of Belgians.
但他們的數量是非常少的，按人均來計算比比利時要少得多
Try to think of one other Muslim-majority country that can say all those same things.
想想看還有哪個以穆斯林為主的國家能夠做到這些
In 2014, I went to Indonesia to ask its current president,
2014年，我到印尼去采訪了現任總統
a soft-spoken technocrat named Joko Widodo,
一個說話溫柔的專家型官員，叫做佐科·維多多
"Why is Indonesia thriving when so many other Muslim states are dying?"
“為什么在其它眾多穆斯林國家走向衰退時印尼卻能保持繁榮？”
"Well, what we realized," he told me,
“嗯，我們意識到，”他告訴我
"is that to deal with extremism, we needed to deal with inequality first."
“要想打擊恐怖主義，我們首先需要消除不平等。”
See, Indonesia's religious parties, like similar parties elsewhere,
瞧，印尼的宗教政黨像其它類似的政黨一樣
had tended to focus on things like reducing poverty and cutting corruption.
趨向于聚焦在減少貧困和腐敗的問題上
So that's what Joko and his predecessors did too, thereby stealing the Islamists' thunder.
佐科和他的前任們做的另一件事，就是降低伊斯蘭主義的影響。
They also cracked down hard on terrorism,
他們還強力打擊了恐怖主義
but Indonesia's democrats have learned a key lesson from the dark years of dictatorship,
但是印尼的民主人士從獨裁統治的黑暗歲月里也學到了一個很重要的教訓
namely that repression only creates more extremism.
即壓制只會造就更多的恐怖主義。
So they waged their war with extraordinary delicacy.
因此他們非常精密地發動了他們的戰爭。
They used the police instead of the army.
他們使用警察而不是軍隊
They only detained suspects if they had enough evidence. They held public trials.
他們只在有足夠證據的情況下才拘留嫌犯。他們實行公開審判。
They even sent liberal imams into the jails to persuade the jihadists that terror is un-Islamic.
他們甚至還派開明的阿訇去監獄勸說圣戰主義者，告訴他們恐怖活動是反伊斯蘭的
And all of this paid off in spectacular fashion,
所有的這些獲得了巨大的回報
creating the kind of country that was unimaginable 20 years ago.
創造了一個20年前無法想象得到的國家。
So at this point, my optimism should, I hope, be starting to make a bit more sense.
因此在這一點上，我的樂觀應該，我希望，開始變得更加有意義了。
